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The BBC's EU Referendum "Great Debate" - Questions on immigration, the economy & sovereignty.

https://youtu.be/Lw4c2dy2qv0

 

The BBC's EU Referendum "Great Debate" - Questions..

 

gino winstanley
People of Britain. When you sweep away all the verbiage, this referendum boils down to one question. Do you want to live in a strong, free and independent country, that is governed by laws to which the people have consented? or, do you want to live in a province of a federal dictatorship, where we do as we are told and have no way of removing the people that govern you? Tough one hey? VOTE LEAVE!

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MarketingDan
nicely boiled down. That is what we're voting for

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Mae Nashtivad
You don't seem to have any economic knowledge whatsoever. The pro Brexit camp claim that nothing will really change and we'll be able to negotiate a trading & residency agreement with the rest of the EU. Everything will be fine & well be able to make out own decisions about curved Bananas, criminal justice & god knows what else. This ignores facts like the ECHR being separate from EU membership. (Legal obligations, multi-lateral treaties & law have been written into the UK's legal framework since the 1950's. The objection to 'Europe interfering with British law' are usually a misunderstanding of legal processed & an admittedly worrying lack of clarity over what is actually going on!).

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Gracie H
+Mae Nashtivad in terms of economics: we have a trade deficit with Europe currently, eu has cut public health grants by £200m this past year, all of our health and social contracts must adhere to the light touch regime meaning any eu member state can win our contracts (tax) and we have to pay a fee to not advertise our contracts. So basically, our rebate money doesn't ever come back to us. To top that, all health and social care contracts have been cut by 20% since last year and commissions encourage us to go 20-40% under the contract value. Huge corporate organisations from the EU win because of TUPE costs and the low salaries of staff. It's disgusting.The EU is crippling our economy, imagine what we could do as the 5th biggest economy without the shackles of the eu. We built them not the other way around.
Mae Nashtivad
LMAO! Britain has found a way to blame everything on EU. The essential basis of EU is free trade: there are other bits, but that is fundamental. If we leave we lose that. The vast majority of UK trade is with the EU (approximately 50%; our next biggest single market is USA at 15%). So those are immediately at risk. The whole point of a free trade area is to make trade easier within it: if you are outside then the obvious corollary is that trade is harder. (This, of course, is why countries want to join). It is much easier for people in a market of 400+million to find an alternative supplier than it will be for UK plc to find a new customer for half of our exports. Many international companies are in UK precisely because it provides access to EU markets: we leave, then those will move. For example, Nissan in Sunderland: we leave EU then there is a 10% tariff on importing cars from outside EU which would make that plant uneconomic. So they close it and move to Ireland, Poland or wherever. Similarly, if we leave EU then Airbus will move out (tariff on an aeroplane wing would cost a LOT) Apparently 3.5 million jobs directly depend on trade with the EU. The cost is small: £120-per person per year against £1,500-£3,500 in benefits from the single market. Also, the next focus in EU trade is to liberalise services: areas Britain is good at (banking, insurance, advertising, law, accountancy). We would be better positioned to be supporting that rather than running away from it. Even if we leave EU we would still need to follow their rules on goods (if we wanted to try to sell to them, or we want to sell to other countries who adopted them anyway). For example, RoHS describes chemicals used in electronics & bans some. Even American firms and Chinese ones follow this - because they want to sell products in France & Germany. So we leave - but we still follow the same obligations. It has not solved any problem people imagine that it will solve (curviness of cucumbers for example). That is aside from comment 2: people think it will solve other problems which are nothing to do with EU anyway. Switzerland, Norway etc have to follow the EU rules even though not members (indeed, amusingly, Dan Hannon suggests we should be like Switzerland - they follow more rules than UK does e.g. they are in Schengen.

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gino winstanley
Excuse me, I'm a little confused. How did you arrive at the conclusion that I have "No economical knowledge"? I never mentioned economics in my comment. Britain has the fifth largest economy in the world, and in my opinion would have no problems trading with the rest of the world! Stop talking Great Britain down! Also, as I'm quite accustom to dealing with keyboard warriors like your good self,  I took the decision to copy and paste the bottom paragraph of your comment into Google. Guess what?You simply copied and pasted your comment from the following link:-https://www.quora.com/What-would-the-consequences-of-a-Brexit-be-for-UK-citizens#!n=12 Funny how the people who have made absolutely no effort to think for them selves are usually the most vocal in demanding respect for their "Ideas".Go and grow a brain.

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Mae Nashtivad
+gino winstanley All you can come up with is, "Britain is fifth largest economy". Anyway, How does that dismiss my Argument? It is still truth though. Great Britain sounds more like Great Quitter. Brexit has lost every economic argument. http://debates.economist.com/ How can you say Britain would have no problem trading with the rest of world? The idea that we could leave the EU and every country will open their arms to U.K. into free trade deals is a fantasy. There will be a significant economic consequences. Canadians themselves say Britain should remain in the EU and that negotiating trade deals outside is hard. Canada still hasn't got its deal with the USA after 7 years of trying. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/may/19/brexit-canada-urges-britain-stay-eu-justin-trudeau

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Gracie H
+Mae Nashtivad I think you should watch Andrew Neil talking with George Osborne because you are completely wrong and have been misled.

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John Sampson
+Mae, you type complete rubbish. Go and spend some time looking at what is happening to the Chinese Steel, British Steel and then the Fisheries.

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Mae Nashtivad
+John Sampson We should lead not leave. let's hope for the Best. I think Remain will win with the majority. Later folks. 

2

MarketingDan
+Mae Nashtivad being the fifth largest economy is very significant. Hand waiving like that is not an argument. It means we can do more than fine like all the other western countries that aren't a member. The idea that the rest of the world wouldn't want to trade with us is what is fantasy. Tell that to the Aussies, the Swiss. The EU has more to lose than us if they whack massive tariffs on us. They're barley holding it all together as it is. The next greek bail out is right after the referendum. For the largest trading block in the world  they have roughly the same GDP as the US (which isn't doing great) but they have 200 million more people in the EU - that's atrocious. The EU is screwed. And that's not even mentioning the immigration argument.

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Mr Ezkerrera
Except the directly elected European Parliament and the Council of Ministers (a body composed of ministers put forth by each of the democratically elected national governments) must both pass legislation put forth by the Commission for such to become law. So yes, actually your directly elected MEPs must 'consent' to the 'laws' you seem so petrified of. And the European Commission is directly accountable to the European Parliament. The parliament must accept the appointment of all Commissioners before they can take office; the parliament elects the President of the Commission; the parliament can propose legislation to the Commission; the parliament can set up investigative bodies to investigate whatever they like within the EU including the actions of the Commission; and most importantly the parliament can disband the Commission. So yes, your directly elected MEPs can remove 'the people that govern you'.
John Sampson
+Mr Ezkerrera That's just silly and  completely wrong. Look at the ridiculous Banana Commission Regulation (EC) 2257/94...Did we vote in favour of or against and is this EU law today. For heavens sake go and at least get some understanding of how they get things are done in the EU and how the law makers end up in the EU, appointed and how measures or regulations, agreements are presented and discussed.

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Rita Shaw
+Ezkerrera: Wrong. The EU parliament is allowed to debate, not to vote. The Commissioners listen to the debate and then THEY make the decisions. The MEPs have no powers to change a thing. LOOK UP the Conditions of EU Membership in the Internet. The powers of the Commission are absolute, irreversible, untouchable, unrepealable. The Commission can take us to law, we cannot take it to law. The conditions expressly state that it is NOT 'accountable' to anyone, anywhere, anyhow. It is dictatorship honed to absolute perfection. The only way to escape is by leaving. I refer you to the Comments of Anne Wiggins in reply to an online article in support of Remain entitled "A Happy Brexit? Not a chance"... available at MS News.. EU Referendum: In or Out. Ms Wiggins debunks the article and explains the modus operandi of the EU with bare facts and rare clarity.

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Mr Ezkerrera
+John Sampson Actually, it isn't law today. It was amended numerous times since 1994 and was actually replaced in 2011. May I just add that such was passed in 1994 so it is unlikely that the Parliament were able to vote on agricultural matters such as that (however, I'm not certain). The Lisbon Treaty granted the Parliament powers of codecision with the Council i.e. what I said is far from 'completely wrong'. Today, legislature must be passed by the Parliament and Council in order to become law. If you want to critique the now obsolete 1994 European Union then feel free but it's changed a lot since then.
John Sampson
Wrong again. There are different voting structures and EU MEPS in Parliament do vote.
Mr Ezkerrera
+Rita Shaw I'm pretty sure you attempted to point this out to me on another video. I replied and you never got back to me. If you want me to answer again then let me know but in the mean time you could look through some of your old posts.
Mr Ezkerrera
+John Sampson Yes, they do today on almost all issues. They didn't prior to the Lisbon Treaty. The law you referenced was from 1994 i.e. it was prior to the Lisbon Treaty.
John Sampson
Well I was using that as an example to say we have no control and can be out voted and by passed even on Vetoed issues. Anyways, I use the http://www.votewatch.eu/en/term8-tajikistan-situation-of-prisoners-of-conscience-joint-motion-for-resolution-vote-resolution.html to track votes made by EU MEPS and also includes votes made by the Council.
Mr Ezkerrera
+John Sampson That would also mean you have 'no control' over what happens in the UK either. I mean, I've never voted in Parliament but I guess I can't speak for you. I just normally vote for the guy that votes in Parliament, you know just like in the EU.
Hitsuga Aorusaki
anarchist-communist. Opinion discarded
Russ G
Trudeau doesn't speak for all Canadians on Brexit. Most Canadians don't even know what Brexit is. Vote Leave never mind what Trudeau (The budgets will balance themself guy) has to say.

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Mae Nashtivad
So Brexit economic plan is "We will be fine because, We are the fifth largest economy" It seems to me Brexiteers don't care about Economic consequences. How can Brexiter be so thick to not take into any consideration about Expert views?
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